On my radio broadcast today, I announced that Pastor MacArthur would be joining me on the air this Thursday from 2-3 PM, EST. At the end of the show, I received some tweets from a pastor in Houston who contacted Phil Johnson, John MacArthur’s right hand man, to confirm this. Mr. Johnson called Pastor MacArthur who said he had heard nothing about the interview until now and he had no interest in being on the air. So, what are the facts?
On December 5th, I received this email from the publicist at Thomas Nelson who sent me the Strange Fire book a couple of months ago. She wrote:
Hi Dr. Brown,
I wanted to see if you’d still be interested in having John MacArthur join you on your radio show to talk about Strange Fire. He is available on two specific dates for interviews. Do these jive with your schedule? Would love to make it work.
Thurs 12/12 – 12-3pm ET
Wed 12/18 – 4-7pm ET
Thanks!
I wrote back the same day:
Thanks so much for following up! Yes, Thursday, 12-12, between 2-3 PM would be perfect (however much time he could give me). He should know that I have a very different perspective but will be approaching the subject with humility and a heart for unity.
I’m copying my producer Matt Corbin as well.
Let’s lock this in, and again, thanks so much!
Dr. Brown
Normally, Matt books the guests for me, but I was happy to do this directly, seeing it was Pastor MacArthur’s publicist. I also added the extra information reminding her of our disagreement (I explained that to her when I first requested an advanced copy of the book), thinking to my myself that she was given windows of time for interviews, that she was now filling them in, but when word got back to him that this interview was with me, he would decline.
The next day, December 6th, she wrote back to me:
Dr. Brown,
Thursday 12-12 from 2-3 PM ET will work well. Consider it confirmed.
Matt, I will reply to your email shortly with additional detail. [Matt was requesting the contact phone number, etc., as is standard, since our studio calls the person we’re interviewing when possible.]
Thanks!
Even though I had the confirmation on Friday, I still waited until Monday to say anything, still giving them time to cancel — although this would have been the first time a publicist confirmed an interview with us without the person actually knowing about it — and when there was no further communication beyond the confirmation, I announced it on the air.
As soon as I received the news via twitter that Pastor MacArthur would not be on the show, which I considered reliable, as Phil Johnson had been copied on every tweet, Matt called the publicist and emailed me back (I’m still in India):
Just got off the phone with her. She is going to check with her contact at JM and call me back today. As of Friday she had the thumbs up from the individual they always deal with from JM ministry.
Matt then followed up with another email after hearing back from the publicist:
According to her there was a breakdown among media team. One said yes, one said no.
This was do to a change in the media approval process.
So, wherever the mixup was, it was not on our end, and based on Mr. Johnson’s tweets, I don’t doubt that today was the first that Pastor MacArthur heard he was scheduled to be on the air with me. What we do know is that he declined the invitation, which doesn’t surprise me at all. In fact, in the second hour on the air today, I said that it was a major thing for him to do this and I truly appreciated it. On my end, I had been giving this prayerful thought, asking the Lord how I could ask probing questions that would move our discussion forward while being totally respectful towards him.
Unfortunately, where this leaves us is that, to date: 1) I have received no response from Pastor MacArthur’s people to my many requests for a face to face, private meeting to discuss the issues together with other key leaders (other than that he was taking a break after the Strange Fire conference and celebrating his 50th wedding anniversary — and congratulations on that!); 2) I have received no response to my request for a public, moderated debate on the question of whether the NT gifts of the Spirit are for today (this would be with him or one of his leaders or seminary professors); 3) he has declined to come on the air with me to discuss the issues.
To be clear, though, I never said or implied that he approved the interview and then cancelled out. I neither thought this to myself nor reported it others, and again, the whole time, I was pleasantly surprised that he consented to do the interview.
To respond briefly to some embarrassing comments that were made: 1) No, we did not contact him directly to confirm the interview. Sorry to say I don’t have his personal cell phone number, nor is it normal policy to bypass a person’s publicist to confirm things directly with the person you’re booking. 2) No, I didn’t manufacture this whole story with the interest of promoting my new Authentic Fire book. (Yes, a few folks accused me of this!) What makes this silly accusation all the more absurd is that these same folks seemed to have no problem with Pastor MacArthur holding a major conference that was promoted for months leading up to the publication of his book. (I have no problem with that at all; the irony is just glaring.)
That being said, by all means, I want everyone to read my Authentic Fire book, which should be released as an e-book (and by print on demand through our ministry) in the next day or two. That’s why I write books, and that’s why other authors write books, so people will read them, because we believe deeply in the message. But the focus on our interview was going to be on his book, not mine. I have plenty of air time already to talk about Authentic Fire.
Finally, in a post earlier today I noted that, “It is mind-boggling but not surprising that some in the Strange Fire camp are accusing us of putting out false information regarding the interview with Pastor MacArthur.” I did not mean leadership or staff of Pastor MacArthur. I was referring to those who were in agreement with the Strange Fire conference and book. They do not represent anyone officially on Pastor MacArthur’s behalf.
