Naomi Shubert posted a comment · Nov 04, 2017
I think the disciples did misunderstand, but I think the idea of irony goes against the whole mood and tone of the passage. Jesus concerned for his disciples and the imminent destruction and chaos coming upon the Jewish people and his own death and the immediate aftermath. As an older mother I am very aware of my mortality and concerned for the wellbeing of my child. This is a deathbed concern to be understood on a human level. He would not be with them on a physical level to protect them. If we forget the humanity of Jesus ( let this cup pass from me etc), we do not see the victory that follows in all it's fullness. And which is ours too, even if in this life we suffer loss and defeat and have fears over ours and our childrens' safety. Let's be clear, swords or guns will never adequately protect us. And some of us may lay our lives down willingly as martyrs and others of us may fight ( as happened in Europe) and be killed by an overwhelming enemy - but it is our faith and our acting within the confines of Heavens will on earth, not our will, which gives us any victory in this world.
texasaggie posted a comment · Nov 03, 2017
I think Jesus knew he had to go to the cross and the swords he recommended in Luke 22 would help insure that and fulfill prophesy. He didn't exactly seem shocked that two of them had swords already. And the commandment is, after all, "Don't Murder" not "Don't Kill". On the other hand, it is hard to get people saved if we kill them first. I have to say that so many Jesus people and free people with guns in Houston are probably why we had so little looting during the flooding from Hurricane Harvey. I understand what Dr. Brown is saying though.
Rose posted a comment · Nov 03, 2017
I find it hard to imagine Jesus being "ironic" with His disciples and using the two swords as props to make Him look like a bad guy. I don't know, it seems deceptive to me, and of course He is not deceptive at all. Even if He was "joking" about the swords, it just seems like a stretch. He was giving instructions about what to bring, why wouldn't the swords be taken seriously along with everything else???
DLM posted a comment · Oct 31, 2017
Weapon ownership has absolutely nothing to do with Salvation! It's not an indicator of my walk in Faith. It doesn't show the depth of my love, compassion and obedience to the one true God. Now, the use of the weapon may be a good indicator of my Faith
Mike on the Wall posted a comment · Oct 30, 2017
Psalm 82:4 Rescue the weak and needy; Deliver them out of the hand of the wicked. Proverbs 24:11 Deliver those who are drawn toward death, And hold back those stumbling to the slaughter. Ezekiel 33 "... 6 'But if the watchman sees the sword coming and does not blow the trumpet, and the people are not warned, and a sword comes and takes a person from them, he is taken away in his iniquity; but his blood I will require from the watchman's hand.' Exodus 22:2-3 2 "If the thief is found breaking in, and he is struck so that he dies, there shall be no guilt for his bloodshed. 3 "If the sun has risen on him, there shall be guilt for his bloodshed. Nehemiah 4 17 Those who were rebuilding the wall and those who carried burdens took their load with one hand doing the work and the other holding a weapon. 18 As for the builders, each wore his sword girded at his side as he built, while the trumpeter stood near me. ... 21 So we carried on the work with half of them holding spears from dawn until the stars appeared. .... 23 So neither I, my brothers, my servants, nor the men of the guard who followed me, none of us removed our clothes, each took his weapon even to the water. Ok -- Several scriptures say self defense is ok // even with a sword or gun (today) However, Murder and blood shed intentionally not allowed. If you live somewhere where you have reason to be concerned about crime, this would be similar to legally carrying a weapon to defend your family, even when running daily errands to the store. Esther 8:11-12 11 By these letters the king permitted the Jews who were in every city to gather together and protect their lives -- to destroy, kill, and annihilate all the forces of any people or province that would assault them, both little children and women, and to plunder their possessions... Psalm 144:1 Blessed be the LORD my strength, which teacheth my hands to war, and my fingers to fight: Psalm 18:34 He teaches my hands to make war, So that my arms can bend a bow of bronze But how do we reconcile: Psalm 44:6-7 For I will not trust in my bow, Nor shall my sword save me. 7 But You have saved us from our enemies, And have put to shame those who hated us. Here is a warning: If you find that you have anger or self-control problems, owning weapons is unwise. The believer is to be "not soon angry, no brawler, no striker" (Titus 1:7). Lamech is an example of someone who should not own weapons (Gen. 4:23f). Rom 12:19 Never take your own revenge, beloved, but leave room for the wrath of God, for it is written, "Vengeance is Mine, I will repay," says the Lord.
F4PhantomGIB posted a comment · Oct 29, 2017
Hello Dr Brown I read both articles with keen interest. As a new follower of Christ I had taken the whole issue at face value: Of course we have the right to self defense and to use whatever weapons are necessary. Or do we, I thought after reading your articles. I think the root cause of your premise, Since when did the Gospel become connected with guns, may be found in the right to self defense. Our Founders wrote that we were endowed with certain unalienable rights endowed by our Creator. Does God grant us a right to self-defense? If so does God place any limits on that right? I don't know. Thank you for a very thought provoking series of articles. I look forward to your thoughts. Sincerely F4PhantomGIB
Bguptill posted a comment · Oct 28, 2017
Btw, if I could offer an alternative reason evangelicals connect God & guns it is because we are more connected to the mindset of the founders (most of whom who were dedicated believers). The Declaration of Independence says we are “endowed by our creator with certain inalienable rights. In practice this means government doesn’t have the authority to limit or take away a God-given right. It’s not Biblical, it’s civic. Carrying a gun was considered by the founders a civic duty, not a spiritual mandate. We should have the same view. Guns have nothing to do with the gospel, but everything to do with guarding society against tyrannical influences.
Bguptill posted a comment · Oct 28, 2017
John 18:8 Jesus answered, “I told you that I am he. If you are looking for me, then let these men go.” 9 This happened so that the words he had spoken would be fulfilled: “I have not lost one of those you gave me.” Jesus tells the to bring two swords (which they were bearing openly, they didn’t leave them at home). Then Peter cuts off an ear, and Jesus heals the priests servant Malachi’s and tells Peter not to defend him. In fact, Jesus could have called 12 legions to defend him. Jesus Himself gives the reason for the swords in John 18:9 - the defense & safety of the disciples. Being armed, they wanted to avoid a fight, and so they heeded Jesus’ recommendation to take him only & not the disciples. I don’t believe the gospel should be connected with guns. I don’t think guns have any relevance to scripture, just as the swords were a tool that served a purpose and were neither good nor bad unless they were used for good or evil purposes. Clearly, God used the Old Testament Jews to make war against nations (guns would be used in today’s war) on a regular basis. God doesn’t say “make war, but eschew the sword.” The sword is not relevant, just as the gun isn’t relevant, but is a tool used by either the good guys or bad guys. I agree, there is no reason to connect the gospel & guns. NO LINK. This goes both ways... not only is it not linked, it is not unlinked (or prohibited) by scripture.